ESSPW - Big changes

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ESSPW - Big changes

Postby Fred Johnson » Thu Oct 13, 2011 11:46 am

Wow. The new Eagle project workbook is a big change. I very very much like it. We had problems a few years ago that was pushing potential Eagles away. It all came down to overly intense district review of the Eagle project workbook and plans. It had become less about doing something good for the community and more about extracting a pound of flesh from those wanting to be Eagle.

I very much like the new workbook approach.

I know this link is not the official location, but it's the new version I found.
http://www.troop439.net/512-927_Eagle_Scout_Service_Project_Workbook.pdf

...
...

I think Cannon and HP will like the new GTA and ESSPW. That cover page sure has a lot of green. Think of all the extra ink cartridges they will sell. :)
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby smtroop168 » Thu Oct 13, 2011 12:05 pm

The ink issue is being fixed as well as the omission of Scout hours on pg 20. The pdf fillable one will be posted on scouting.org very soon.

Don't be fooled that the WB doesn't have the scout still needing to provide a great deal of planning information (just not as granular) to get his Proposal approved and also don't be fooled that the Final Plan is only "strongly recommended" because the scout who doesn't use it might be the fool at the end.
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby Fred Johnson » Thu Oct 13, 2011 12:12 pm

Oh I agree. It's more a matter of emphasis and approach. I think the new version is more friendly toward the scout and with stronger emphasis that it's about service and leadership and less about producing a corporate project management plan. I'm just looking forward to not having five district review cycles over three months.
Last edited by Fred Johnson on Thu Oct 13, 2011 3:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby smtroop168 » Thu Oct 13, 2011 12:16 pm

Fred Johnson wrote:Oh I agree. It's more a matter of emphasis and approach. I think the new version is more friendly toward the scout and with stronger emphasis that it's about service and leadership and less about producing a corporate project management plan.

I'm just looking forward to not having five district review cycles where at the 5th review the district Eagle advancement rep says to add in a map and directions to the nearest hospital. (Hanging closet bookshelves is not that overly dangerous.)


Bingo! You hit one of the main reasons for the new approach.
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby bnelso » Fri Oct 14, 2011 5:17 pm

At the board of review, if an approved proposal and any subsequent effort represents planning and development
that was adequate to the project, and the project was well led and carried out to the satisfaction of the unit
leader and project beneficiary, only in a very rare case would rejection result. It would have to be clearly
established that Eagle Scout requirement 5—as written— was not completed. Under no circumstances may final
project approval be withheld for reasons that have nothing to do with the project.

...

This is not only part of the requirement, but relates to practicing our motto to “Be Prepared.”

However, in determining if a project meets requirement 5, reviewers must not require more planning and development than necessary to execute the project. These elements must not overshadow the project itself, as long as the effort was well led, and resulted in otherwise worthy outcome acceptable to the beneficiary.


Ref: Guide to Advancement - 9.0.2.13 Evaluating the Project After Completion
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby Bill Pitcher » Fri Oct 14, 2011 8:37 pm

I can live with the new ESSPW, but as an educator, I feel it takes away the Eagle Candidate's individuality. Everyone's ESSP package will look the same . . . a "cookie cutter" approach. Sorry, Matt. And giving them the option to not do a final plan . . . woah, that spells trouble to me.

BTW, any changes in the Eagle Rank Application?
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby smtroop168 » Fri Oct 14, 2011 8:57 pm

Bill Pitcher wrote:I can live with the new ESSPW, but as an educator, I feel it takes away the Eagle Candidate's individuality. Everyone's ESSP package will look the same . . . a "cookie cutter" approach. Sorry, Matt. And giving them the option to not do a final plan . . . woah, that spells trouble to me.

BTW, any changes in the Eagle Rank Application?


It's funny but some are illusion (my B-I-L too) that this is MY EWB and GTA. The only actually wording I will lay claim to in the WB is the "If you submit your proposal too close to your 18th birthday, it may not be approved in time to finish planning and executing the project"

The finish planning is the Final Plan. Any scout who does not complete the FP is not too bright and any of the 4 signatories and/or the EP Coach that allow that to happen are not helping the scout.

Don't think there are any changes to MY Eagle App. :P
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby smtroop168 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 5:37 pm

"Providing Quality Info One Paragraph At A Time"
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby PGH » Wed Oct 26, 2011 11:59 am

How do you report a bug in the work book? It looks like the Unit Leader's name from page 6 populates the candidate's name on page 8. If you change the name on page 8, the Scout becomes SM. :D
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby smtroop168 » Sun Oct 30, 2011 9:55 pm

PGH wrote:How do you report a bug in the work book? It looks like the Unit Leader's name from page 6 populates the candidate's name on page 8. If you change the name on page 8, the Scout becomes SM. :D


Known error but any comments onthe book can be sent to advancement.team@scouting.org
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby Fred Johnson » Mon Oct 31, 2011 3:58 pm

Just some feed back. It's interesting to watch change in motion.

The volume level is high. I've been in a few district meetings and discussion is loud. :lol: I sort of expected that. "yet again watering down Eagle". "Taking the ground out from under us". "No Eagle project quality control".

I've also heard a few quiet supporters speak up ... including me. :D
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby cdwscout » Mon Oct 31, 2011 4:27 pm

As a scout, I really like the new "streamlined" eagle workbook. The old one was started to get "old", and our district/council had stopped using it in favor of a even more annoying word .doc. I am using the new workbook for my project, and I think it's going to be a whole lot easier than using the old workbook, which will give me more time to do other things (such as actually carrying out the project).
Yours in scOUTING,
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby smtroop168 » Tue Nov 01, 2011 3:05 pm

Fred Johnson wrote:Just some feed back. It's interesting to watch change in motion.

The volume level is high. I've been in a few district meetings and discussion is loud. :lol: I sort of expected that. "yet again watering down Eagle". "Taking the ground out from under us". "No Eagle project quality control".

I've also heard a few quiet supporters speak up ... including me. :D


Those with the loud volume are the exact reason for the change. These are the ones who run scouts through 8 to 10 to 12 reviews to ensure the scout had the exact number of screws, rakes, people there and yes the GPS coordinates of the EP site and pick up truck bed sizes to haul the materials.
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby Fred Johnson » Tue Nov 15, 2011 3:55 pm

PGH wrote:How do you report a bug in the work book? It looks like the Unit Leader's name from page 6 populates the candidate's name on page 8. If you change the name on page 8, the Scout becomes SM. :D
Anyone have a link to a fixed version? We have a scout looking to use it.
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby RWSmith » Tue Nov 15, 2011 4:14 pm

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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby Fred Johnson » Tue Nov 15, 2011 4:32 pm

That is the one that's broken. Unit leader name on page 6 is assigned to scout name on page 8. If you change scout name on page 8, he then is the unit leader on page 6.

A little white out will fix it, but it would be nice to have a good version.
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby smtroop168 » Tue Nov 15, 2011 5:39 pm

The one I just downloaded from scouting.org has the pg6/pg 8 item fixed
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby ronin718 » Wed Nov 16, 2011 9:09 am

I just tested it off the link in Doing your Eagle Scout Leadership Service Project and it worked just fine. Entry for Scout's name on page six fills in page eight. The unit leader is no longer the Scout.
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby RWSmith » Wed Nov 16, 2011 10:58 am

ronin718 wrote:.... The unit leader is no longer the Scout.

"The unit leader is no longer the Scout."

Dude,

Can I pulleezzz use that as my new tagline?
:lol:
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Re: ESSPW - Big changes

Postby ronin718 » Thu Nov 17, 2011 9:28 am

RWSmith wrote:
ronin718 wrote:.... The unit leader is no longer the Scout.

"The unit leader is no longer the Scout."

Dude,

Can I pulleezzz use that as my new tagline?
:lol:


Go for it... The copyright has been released... :mrgreen:
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