Camping - 9b Verticle Feet

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Camping - 9b Verticle Feet

Postby JButterfield » Wed Nov 29, 2006 3:03 am

Regarding the vertical feet gain requirement in 9b: does this mean the hike must be 1000 feet from low point to high point? or 1000 feet from beginning to end? or a cummulative 1000 (i.e., up 500, down 300 up 100 down 200 up 400)? I have had a number of opinions on this
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Postby Mrw » Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:24 am

I would think a total, cumulative elevation gain.

And depending on the part of the country you are in, even that might be a challenge to find.
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Postby evmori » Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:52 am

Let's look at the requirement

9b. On any of these camping experiences, you must do TWO of the following, only with proper preparation and under qualified supervision:

1. Hike up a mountain, gaining at least 2,000 vertical feet.


To me the key word is gaining. So if you start at 0 you must be 2,000 feet higher to complete the requirement.
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Postby gwd-scouter » Wed Nov 29, 2006 10:55 am

Hey Ed, they changed the requirement this year. It is only 1,000 feet now. I agree that from whatever elevation you start, you must gain 1,000 by the end.
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Postby evmori » Wed Nov 29, 2006 11:23 am

gwd-scouter wrote:Hey Ed, they changed the requirement this year. It is only 1,000 feet now. I agree that from whatever elevation you start, you must gain 1,000 by the end.


Sorry. Got that info from meritbadge.com.
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Postby scoutaholic » Wed Nov 29, 2006 11:30 am

requirements wrote:Hike up a mountain, gaining at least 1,000 vertical feet.

evmori wrote:To me the key word is gaining. So if you start at 0 you must be 2,000 feet higher to complete the requirement.


If you take the requirement literally, you simply have to gain 1000 vertical feet. I would think that if the high point is 1000 feet higher than the low point, or the end is 1000 feet higher than the start then you have satisfied the requirement. If your hike goes up and down the same 100 feet 10 times, I would not be inclined to count that. However, the final interpretation is up to the MB counselor.

In my area, there are plenty of places where you can hike 1000 vertical feet. One of the most popular day hikes in the area is 5000 vertical feet, and our troop does it as an overnight backpack trip every year. For you flatlanders, you may have to do the same 100 feet several times to make a total of 1000 feet ascent. Talk with the MB Counselor to see how they interpret the requirement.
Last edited by scoutaholic on Wed Nov 29, 2006 2:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby deweylure » Wed Nov 29, 2006 12:43 pm

It is 1000 cumaltive feet. In Norhtern Ill Its hard to do it without going up and down. talk to thuje MBC to find out his or her interpretaion.

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Postby gwd-scouter » Wed Nov 29, 2006 12:47 pm

From us scouting service project website - usscouts.org (which I think most times has more up to date info on merit badges). Among other changes, this is the new 9b (Jan. 2006)

9b. On any of these camping experiences, you must do TWO of the following, only with proper preparation and under qualified supervision:

Hike up a mountain, gaining at least 1,000 vertical feet.
Backpack, snowshoe, or cross-country ski for at least 4 miles.
Take a bike trip of at least 15 miles or at least four hours.
Plan and carry out a float trip of at least four hours.
Plan and carry out an overnight snow camping experience.
Rappel down a rappel route of 30 feet or more.
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Postby WeeWillie » Thu Nov 30, 2006 12:13 am

Dewey

Let's stop trying to create mole hills out of mountains. The reason they give 6 options is to address regional differences. If you don't have mountains that rise at least 1000 feet, try another option.
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Postby deweylure » Thu Nov 30, 2006 10:47 am

Wee Willie

I am not making a mountain out of a mole hill. I understand the requirements. I simply was expressing my opinion in regard to the original post.

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Postby mhjacobson » Fri Dec 15, 2006 4:37 pm

It is 1000 cumulative feet!
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Postby WeeWillie » Fri Dec 15, 2006 11:53 pm

Dewey

My comment making MOLEHILLS out of MOUNTAINS was a play on words and not an insult. I am sorry if you took it that way.

All

The requirement states " Hike UP a mountain, gaining at least 1,000 verticle feet." UP is positive. DOWN is negative. Cummulative can mean UP and DOWN. The requirement only states UP. At some time during your hike you should have been 1000 feet higher than where you started.

If we accept the cummulative arguement that where do you draw the line.

500 Up 500 Down 500 Up

100 Up 100 Down 100 Up times 10

50 Up, 50 Down, 50 Up times 20

25 Up, 25 Down, 25 Up times 40

10 Up, 10 Down, 10 Up times 100

5 Up, 5 Down, 5 Up times 200

2.5 Up, 2.5 Down, 2.5 Up times 400

1.25 Up, 1.25 Down, 1.25 times 800

The requirement includes 6 options with several options within options. If you don't have mountains in your area, do the others. It doesn't snow much where I live so requirement #5 is out of the question for T480.
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Postby mhjacobson » Sat Dec 16, 2006 1:24 pm

Sometimes forums become a little ridiculous:

The latest poster shows how one can often misread a post and come up with a response to the post. The operative wording in the requirement is "gain." The word cumulative does not state that one could go up 20 feet and then down 20 feet and then up 20 feet to count as 40 feet, and in fact means the opposite

The word cumulative means that one can walk up 100 feet, then work on a plain for a period of time and then walk up another 100 feet for a CUMULATIVE GAIN of 200 feet. Each time that someone walks down during a hike, it actaully results in a LOSS in the CUMULATIVE height that the person has gained.
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Camping-9b vertical feet

Postby jhawk » Mon Dec 18, 2006 12:03 pm

It means you hike from a beginning elevation of say 2100 feet to 3100 feet. It does not mean you hike up a 100 foot hill 10 times. Not every state has the potential to be the place to fulfill this requirement. You either go where you can do it or you pick a different option. We live in Kansas but fulfilled this requirement in Colorado. That's why there are several options and a scout only has to pick two he can do.
If it were meant to be done hiking up and down a gully on the prairie, there probably wouldn't be other options for scouts who have no access to 1000 vertical feet hikes.
If this had been an actual hiking emergency, you would have been informed where to tune in your area for further news and information....
I have no problem with picking easier options to fulfill, but let's not water down requirements that clearly have options. It takes away something from the boys who worked hard to do it right. Can't hike it locally? Then take a trip. Don't want to? Then do one of the other options.
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