Finishing two ranks at once?

Scout Badge, Tenderfoot, Second Class, First Class, Star, Life, and Eagle Palms.

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Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby Fibonacci » Mon Aug 16, 2010 12:48 pm

Several of our 2nd year Scouts stalled at Tenderfoot, but after a good summer troop program, a dedicated Troop Instructor, and a successful (fun) week at Summer Camp, they're getting requirements done. As Advancement Chair, I'm pleased!

One Scout has completed all the requirements for both Second Class and First Class and has requested Boards of Review for both. If it seems okay with you experienced and knowledgeable folks, I'd like to have the Second Class BoR with 3 Committee Members, then immediately after this Board to hold a second Board for First Class with 3 different Committee Members. (We have a large troop and hold our Boards before the Troop Meeting so the Scout doesn't miss out on the fun.)

Does that seem reasonable, or is it more appropriate to hold both Boards at the same time? I want each Scout to have the experience of sitting with different Troop Committee members for his Boards.
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby smtroop168 » Mon Aug 16, 2010 1:06 pm

Either way works. If you have the option to have separate members for each BOR, that's what I would do.

The fact scouts can work on T/2/1 at the same time is still my #1 pet peeve with the advancement system. To me it really doesn't allow them to grow.

Curious on what 2nd class requirement(s) were holding up this scout from making 2nd earlier?

Also since the scout may only advance one rank using the "old" requirements, did he complete all the 1st class rank requirements changes for 2010? Such as Demonstating Leave No Trace on his troop events (#3) or Discussing specific examples on how he has lived the points of the scout law (#12)?
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby FrankJ » Mon Aug 16, 2010 1:27 pm

Schedule them three months apart under the new moon. After all it is the scout's fault for falling behind. :evil:

Actual sounds like you have the plan. It is nice to have two boards of review, but if they are back to back, it really like one so just one works just as well. The more I think about it one that is a little longer might better than two short ones that asks the same questions. If you have two, I would have the boards coordinate the questions so that they are different.
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby evmori » Mon Aug 16, 2010 1:42 pm

Either way sounds great to me or you could have one BoR for both at the same time.
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby Fibonacci » Mon Aug 16, 2010 2:07 pm

Thank you for the feedback.

I think I'll suggest a few specific topics to each group of Board members. That's a great idea.
2nd Class: reason for advancement delay, feedback about Summer Camp
1st Class: most useful Scout Skills learned, areas of leadership that are most interesting, future merit badges
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby lifescoutforlife » Tue Aug 17, 2010 6:38 am

Boys in our Troop hardly ever wear the Tenderfoot rank because they take the first year program at camp and usally finish all the requirements that they didn't do before camp for the ranks and Tenderfoot & 2nd Class. To do this they must also take First Aid & Swimming merit badges because they cover a few of the requirements needed. Then they do have BOR's for both ranks and we are always changing up the BOR people as the BOR's are going on so the boys get to meet different commitee members.
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby kwildman » Tue Aug 17, 2010 1:09 pm

sm - remember that the "goal" from national advancement is first class in the first year. Making them seperate would be hard to accomplish and there isnt much growth happening in a year. Kids that dont advance dont stay in the program.
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby smtroop168 » Tue Aug 17, 2010 1:47 pm

kwildman wrote:sm - remember that the "goal" from national advancement is first class in the first year. Making them seperate would be hard to accomplish and there isnt much growth happening in a year. Kids that dont advance dont stay in the program.


"Back in the day" (circa 1966) you earned your Tenderfoot. Then you started 2nd class and had to be a TF for one month before you could become a 2nd class. Then you started 1st class and had to be a 2nd for 2 months before you could become 1st class. You certainly could make 1st in in a year but there was some building block process.

It was 3 months 1st to Star; 3 months Star to Life and 6 months Life to Eagle. Life to Eagle in 15 months.

When I read that scouts never wore their Tenderfoot badge, I wonder if that's the way to go???

You also had to show by your attendance record that you were active. - that's a different discussion
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby kwildman » Wed Aug 18, 2010 8:58 am

smtroop168 wrote:
"Back in the day" (circa 1966) you earned your Tenderfoot. ....


Welcome to the 21st century. :roll:
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby smtroop168 » Wed Aug 18, 2010 10:56 am

The 21st Century allows the current procedure so that's what we all do. I don't know why it changed.

Back to the original post...how would you keep the scouts from getting "stalled"? Fibonaaci still hasn't chimed in on my 1st questions and we still don't know what requirements caused the stall.
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby kwildman » Wed Aug 18, 2010 12:40 pm

smtroop168 wrote:The 21st Century allows the current procedure so that's what we all do. I don't know why it changed.

Back to the original post...how would you keep the scouts from getting "stalled"? Fibonaaci still hasn't chimed in on my 1st questions and we still don't know what requirements caused the stall.


I see quite a few stall at the swim test requirements.
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby smtroop168 » Wed Aug 18, 2010 1:36 pm

Found this right on this site:

http://meritbadge.org/wiki/index.php/Fi ... First_Year

1994 did away with tenure between ranks. The 1998 BSHB says you can work on T-2-1 at the same time
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby wjturner » Wed Jul 13, 2011 8:12 am

I know I'm late to this discussion, but I recently joined the board, and I'm looking through interesting old posts. I have to correct the record:

smtroop168 wrote:Found this right on this site:

http://meritbadge.org/wiki/index.php/Fi ... First_Year

1994 did away with tenure between ranks. The 1998 BSHB says you can work on T-2-1 at the same time


Actually, they did away with the tenure between ranks with the 10th edition of the BSHB in 1989. I remember because we instituted a new first year camper program at our camp in 1990 to follow the national goal of first class in a year, which I always thought was funny because it seemed easier to me to get first class in a year under the previous requirements that included tenure.

By the way, to respond to your earlier post, those were a total of 20 months (2 mo each for TF, 2C, and 1C, 4 mo for Star, and 6 mo for Life and Eagle). I know a very dedicated and organized scout who did them in 22 months--and he had to learn how to swim to do it!
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby smtroop168 » Wed Jul 13, 2011 9:08 am

The BSHB 10th Edition ca.1990 removed the T/2/1 tenure requirements as part of the killing off of Skill awards and other items of the 72-89 BS "improved" program.

The BSHB 11th edition ca. 1998 is the first reference I could find that specifically stated you can work on all T/2/1 requirements at the same time.

Of course there were many printings of the 10th edition in which it could have been added in or it could have been in the BSA Requirements Books.
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby wjturner » Wed Jul 13, 2011 3:03 pm

smtroop168 wrote:The BSHB 10th Edition ca.1990 removed the T/2/1 tenure requirements as part of the killing off of Skill awards and other items of the 72-89 BS "improved" program.


Yes, that's what I meant. As I recall, it came out in the fall of 1989. However, even using your approximate date, it contradicts the page cited above, which said it happened in 1994.

smtroop168 wrote:The BSHB 11th edition ca. 1998 is the first reference I could find that specifically stated you can work on all T/2/1 requirements at the same time.


My BSHB is the ninth edition, and I gradually became more inactive as I went to college and grad school, got married, etc., so I can't say. I know our first-year camper program in 1990 was supposed to have the scouts working on T/2/1 at the same time. It may not have been in the literature, but it sure seemed to be understood. I don't think that's a big surprise, though, since under the previous requirements, you could also by working on skill awards in any order. As I recall, there was only the time requirements and maybe the scout spirit requirement that explicitly had to be done since the previous rank.
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Re: Finishing two ranks at once?

Postby FrankJ » Thu Sep 06, 2012 6:33 am

Old thread I know..... But in the new advancement times, the advancement team has stated their opinion in the Advancement News Letter. Separate boards for each rank along with separate SM conferences. Back to back or on separate days at the troops discretion. The Team recommends spacing them out with different BOR members so the scout can be recognized for each advancement.
http://library.constantcontact.com/download/get/file/1109945141041-4/08-2012_09-2012+Advancement+News.pdf
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